Now dont judge me by the title alone. Just hear me out. I work at a Gamestop. Do you know our beat sellers are?Guess?
Sport gamesGTAHalo 3Scarface(?!?)25 to Life( oh come on!)50 cent proof(this is sad)
Where is the variety? I dont want to shoot something! I dont want the game to be realistic! Since when do games undergo to be realistic to be awesome and fun. WHERE IS THE FUN!?!
Sorry I went on a rant there but I had to say something and I am pretty sure I am not the only one who thinks this way. I am no way baised on games. Dont get me do by. Its just how can you blame me. It seems that American developers either:
cant think of anything original or creativepublishers dont be to take risks
and thats just sad. I was watching Bonus Round on Gametrailers com(analyse it out but dont read the comments) and one of them came up with this:
FunFantasyFreedom(able to create any game without or minimal publisher interference)
Rockets(explosions senseless killings)RealismRights(Licences movie games sport games)
I am not saying Western games suck all together its just now I dont see any that arouse me. I just move believe games like Madden sell desire crazy while creative and FUN games like Psychonauts and Odin Sphere gather clean( they are such good games)
Being in the West you are isolated somewhat from the immense teeming oceans of excrement that constitute roughly 80-90% all games with a furnish global distribution. You can see the American crap just fine because you're so close to it but why would the Japanese be to send you their crap?
The be of exporting a game is so great that only the cream of the crap ever gets sent across the Pacific. You don't ever see the terrible terrible games based on tired overused Japanese licenses any more than the Japanese see our terrible terrible licensed games. Without a stabilise diet of the culture of a nation - and I mean
culture the banal suburban-equivalent workaday world not just those aspects of pop culture they choose to sell to foreigners - it is difficult to appreciate just how much of what seems fresh and original over here is just an expression of a different culture's cliché. It's only fresh and original because you haven't been drowned in it the way a Japanese person would be.
In the US people play uninspired FPSen with uninterestingly graphic storylines that take themselves too seriously and grizzled lawless cookie-cutter heroes. In Japan people play uninspired RPGs with uninterestingly melodramatic storylines that take themselves too seriously and androgynous angsty cookie-cutter heroes. The stuff that makes it across the Pacific - in either direction - is the stuff that reminds us why these overused clichés are overused in the first place.
You want a great Western bet released in the past year that's not a shooter not a sports bet not a licensed bet not focused on realism made by someone with a passion for it? I can think of six:
don't. But they exist they're high-quality and they don't touch your hated Three R's. If you can get over your aversion to the first-person viewpoint you can add
and while there are many explosions in these. I'd hardly call any of those senseless. And that's not even scratching the surface of the tip of the indie and freeware games iceberg.
But if it's sales you're complaining about what you'll find is that cliché sells well everywhere.
Bongo Bill I desire your view on this subject and I respect that but the games you suggested to me arent helping. Most of them are war games which means more shooting and killing. I liked God of War 2 but that also had more killing which I dont need to undergo fun. Lord of the Rings is Game based of a book licence. Overlord was cool too but I like to play Pikmin. At least in Metroid prime 3 they mixed things up in the First person genre(not to mention having the beat hold back for a FPS to go out)
And just like Not all Americans compete FPS not all Japanese play RPG. I am saying that the Japanese market has more variety than the American Market. One of my favorite series is Phoenix Wright which would have never been made here. So yeah its not really unfair
But really if you're going to look at the express of Japanese games through rose-tinted glasses at the very least you could do the same for the Americans and Europeans.
I wouldn't look to the PC/Console for variety. They go with what sells and those tried and adjust platforms are not as big a risk taker as newer platforms can afford to be. I see your inform that the variety is lacking. A brief be at new games coming out on those platforms really proves your point. I convey you could go with Atlantis though that isn't very new and I heard it wasn't too good. There are other platforms out there or you could look to older games for the variety you desire.
Some relatively new mobile games that might pique your interest: Petz. Bubble Bash. hit Challenge. Platinum Sodoku?
While Petz has a comprehend of realism there is no violence or sports connected to it. You are just basically raising a virtual pet. breathe Bash takes place on an island but is basically just a block breaking game. Brain Game is puzzles and Sodoku is a math bet. Some variety there all made by a western affiliate.
Also. STALKER was Ukrainian as I recall so I'm not sure if it constitutes a "Western" bet in the strictest sense of the word.
I think Bill is onto something too. Being in the US you undergo a much greater opportunity to see the shit cranked out by American developers whereas imports be to be filtered and appear at a generally higher aim of quality as a result. I often say I've grown to prefer Euro games to American (Shadowgrounds. Painkiller. Max Payne the X-Universe series. Divine Divinity. Dark Messiah of Might and Magic. STALKER (which obviously proves my definition of "Euro" a little loose) and so forth) but I don't have to put up with the presumably-huge pile of crapola they crank out just desire we do. I agree that the vast majority of games released these days are garbage (EA Sports anything and the various GTA-inspired gangsta nonsense are two fix examples) but I don't think it's a uniquely American trait.
I think this article clearly misses some important points. For starters making games is a business to nearly everybody involved. Yes they can be art but Japan and the West as has been pointed out mine the same genres relentlessly.
In the US we definitely benefit from cherry-picked Japanese titles that are sent over here with market research to approve up the release. This usually ends up bringing a host of unique titles and has gone a desire way towards creating games desire Guitar Hero and the upcoming Rock Band.
I evaluate for all the Halos and Half-Life titles there is a Viva Pinata out there somewhere. Jade Empire. Baldurs furnish and Kotor were all great examples of first class Western RPG games and they definitely helped advance the genre. create by mental act a Final fantasy game with a branching storyline where you end some of the action. I cannot think of many Japanese games that accept you the freedom of Oblivion or change surface Fable. Codemaster's Overlord was also an awesome bet.
Let us also not forget about games like Populus the upcoming Spore the ultima games which did more for brining RPGs into the mainstream than anything else. It is very easy to be at the crappy licensed games which are major sellers in this country and romanticize the Japanese gaming merchandise but remember unless you live in lacquer and are an active part of that market how can you really marginalize Western games as derivative and Japanese titles as unique and fresh?
For that matter imagine a Final Fantasy bet that doesn't entail hours upon hours of grinding on mobs.
I'm kind of the inverse of the original poster actually. My preferences skew strongly toward Western games by developers like BioWare and Blizzard and
2K Boston's BioShock was my most recent gaming love affair. I never had consoles growing up though. The first Metroid Prime -- an American take on a Japanese franchise -- was what got me into console gaming.
If you don't want to kill stuff it isn't just Western games you need to be avoiding -- after all those smooshed goombas don't just get up and go away. ;)
For that be create by mental act a Final Fantasy game that doesn't entail hours upon hours of grinding on mobs.
I'm kind of the inverse of the original poster actually. My preferences reorient strongly toward Western games by developers desire BioWare and Blizzard
Any and every Final Fantasy (minus the MMO) can be beaten without "Hours and hours of grinding," much less grinding at all.
Then you go on to quote Blizzard as being one of your favorite developers?
Here's the thing. You're listing only CONSOLE games which pretty much (outside a FEW games) suck hard. Especially american console games. So what you should be doing is checking out all the 90s american PC games. THATS where its at. Fallout. Planescape: Torment. Arcanum. Wizardry 8. X-Com. Dungeon Keeper. StarCraft. Half-Life. know of Magic. Fantasy command and MANY more. If you havent played all of these go do so.
But you're alter if you limit yourself to console games then yes. American games suck.
"Freedom(able to develop any game without or minimal publisher interference)"
If you value freedom - analyse American RPGs to Japanese RPGs. Japanese ones are completely linear typically whereas American ones (Ultima 6/7. Arcanum. Fallout) are completely nonlinear.
And also it is indeed the publishers who create games to suck most of the measure. I have friends who've worked in the industry and they say it is heartbreaking how the publishers crush games before they get anywere off the fasten.
These games designate demographics rather than anything else- Western games are tailored for a Xbox/Gaming Rig audience- i e male. American. 16-30. Japanese games are aimed for a different demographic.
And publishers don't cause games to suck- they decide ones that they evaluate will sell based on prior performance and tend to be conservative as they don't want to end up impoverish. This often ends up backfiring of cover with a dozen near-future Unreal 3 engine-a-likes being released in the same accommodate but that's a different air. An example of games we Westerners only see some of is turn-based 2d alchemy rpgs- we see one or two in a console lifecycle so they are an enjoyable novelty for us. If we saw two or three a year we'd be sick of 'em pretty abstain.
Not that I actually disagree. I also evaluate Western games are rather too narrowly focussed and use non-linearity as a alter for actual storytelling but the grass isn't super-green anywhere else if you be at it closely...
I can accept. There are very few Western game I want to play at all and those are mostly RPGs or some kind of sim/world building or puzzle game. It seems in the West. Graphics == Fun. Like the Crysis engine and DX 10. Many people tell me I HAVE to get Vista because it supports DX10 and I ask "So what" and they furnish me some excerpt about graphics and Crysis and crap. Still not one mention of gameplay comes out of their mouth. It saddens me when I am NOT a gamer because I'm not into grpahics. I don't compassionate for FPS game or another copy paste war game. Or the fact that I like the Wii and find the PS3 lacking. I'm suddenly not a gamer.... True the Wii's library is a bit lacking in the actual content department however the PS3's seems to be lacking in the fun department as well.
So in the end. I'll agree to say that I find the Asian games more appealing to me than the American/European ones. Not only that... Asian game tend to give me more fanservice for women... Just look at the guys of Granado Espada!
I am impressed by the reactions and views by all of you. After reading these. I have a few points i want to explain.
Yes I am only considering console games for this topic not saying that they are insignificant but its a different genre if you ask me. I grew up on console games anyways.
I have no problem if my games undergo linearity in them as desire as it isnt boring. I am comfort playing Resident Evil 4 and that game is linear. As long as the game dosent tell me what to do specifically or is like the King Kong game based of the craptacular movie then I am good.
I am pretty sure American developers can come up with awesome ideas for existing genres and even new ones. Its unfortunate that most publishers like to take fewer bets on alter ideas.
Ever noticed that Japanese companies do well if not better with American licences. I mean look at Capcom. They mad those awesome beat-em-ups with licenses like the Punisher and Alien vs. Predator. Now those were fun. Konami did well with Ninja Turtles and the X-men. Hell when Capcom had the Marvel licence they came together and created the react vs. Capcom series. That was epic. And what did react do? They left Capcom and went with *shudders* EA and created react Nemesis. That was a great game wasnt it?(I am being sarcastic if you are confused)
From Maverynthia"I can agree. There are very few Western bet I want to play at all and those are mostly RPGs or some kind of sim/world building or bedevil game. It seems in the West. Graphics == Fun. desire the Crysis engine and DX 10. Many people tell me I HAVE to get Vista because it supports DX10 and I ask "So what" and they furnish me some excerpt about graphics and Crysis and crap. Still not one mention of gameplay comes out of their mouth. It saddens me when I am NOT a gamer because I'm not into grpahics. I don't care for FPS bet or another copy paste war game. Or the fact that I like the Wii and find the PS3 lacking. I'm suddenly not a gamer.... True the Wii's library is a bit lacking in the actual circumscribe department however the PS3's seems to be lacking in the fun department as well."
Alright lets get a few things straight Crysis is a whole lot deeper than you make it out to be Zera it just looks good doing it. I mean by your standards a bet has to look like utter egest to be fun. Also the people that are producing Kane and Lynch are the same populate that did the hit man series that i though was much more innovative than most games at the time and the game makes you an awesome anti-hero. Also you seem to misunderstand the inform of FPS games. Its not always about killing people. FPS can just penetrate you better and move you into the hero or anti-hero.
P. S. Jade Empire was one of the biggest turds in history and I had to hire someone to exorcise it from my hard control. But I loved KOTOR more than most of my immediate family so I do comfort like bioware.
bue519:Alright lets get a few things straight Crysis is a whole lot deeper than you make it out to be Zera it just looks good doing it. I convey by your standards a game has to look desire communicate egest to be fun. Also the people that are producing Kane and Lynch are the same populate that did the hit man series that i though was much more innovative than most games at the time and the game makes you an awesome anti-hero. Also you seem to misunderstand the point of FPS games. Its not always about killing populate. FPS can just immerse you better and move you into the hero or anti-hero.
P. S. Jade Empire was one of the biggest turds in history and I had to hire someone to exorcise it from my hard control. But I loved KOTOR more than most of my immediate family so I do comfort like bioware.
As far how the bet looks to me its all about the art style. Honestly good art and create by mental act trumps graphics. Not saying both would cause to be perceived though just get the gameplay and fun drink first. As for First-person games it not my fault that 98% of them are shooters. I like the first person idea just bear on it to something different desire adventure. It worked wonders for Metroid fix which was actually developed by A texas based studio. Retro Studios.
Ajar:For that be create by mental act a Final Fantasy bet that doesn't necessitate hours upon hours of grinding on mobs.
I'm kind of the inverse of the original poster actually. My preferences skew strongly toward Western games by developers desire BioWare and Blizzard
Really? Because I've gotten nearly to the end of FFVI and FFVII two of the most lauded titles in the franchise only to find that my party was too weak to win the final battle. I hadn't been grinding.
Actually the only Japanese RPG I've ever played that didn't compel me to grind in order to end the game at some point was Chrono Trigger. [Strategy RPGs like the Fire Emblem series excepted.]
Well yes. Blizzard made WarCraft II. StarCraft. WarCraft III and their expansions which are some of my favourite games. I undergo no interest in MMOs -- I undergo to be very interested in a game's story to bother with grinding -- but when Blizzard announces a non-MMO game. I pay attention.
I accept - sometimes I just want to play something relaxing or just fun.
This is one of the reasons I'm very pleased with XBOX Live Arcade. The games are cheap and a way to play some really off beat games i e. Space Giraffe.
Correct me if im do by but didn't metroid fix involve shooting of some kind. I mean the one of Samus' arms is a weapon. C'mon. Also not all Japanese RPG Rock change surface the one brought over here. I mean cmon hasnt anyone played Blue Dragon. I'd rather make out with a shotgun then go through that game again its just repetitive B. S.
For that matter create by mental act a Final Fantasy game that doesn't entail hours upon hours of grinding on mobs.
I'm kind of the inverse of the original poster actually. My preferences reorient strongly toward Western games by developers like BioWare and Blizzard
Any and every Final Fantasy (minus the MMO) can be beaten without "Hours and hours of grinding," much less grinding at all.
Then you go on to quote Blizzard as being one of your favorite developers?
Zera:Bongo Bill I desire your view on this affect and I consider that but the games you suggested to me arent helping. Most of them are war games which means more shooting and killing. I liked God of War 2 but that also had more killing which I dont be to have fun. Lord of the Rings is Game based of a book licence. Overlord was alter too but I like to play Pikmin. At least in Metroid prime 3 they mixed things up in the First person genre(not to mention having the best hold back for a FPS to go out)
And just like Not all Americans compete FPS not all Japanese play RPG. I am saying that the Japanese merchandise has more variety than the American Market. One of my favorite series is Phoenix Wright which would have never been made here. So yeah its not really unfair
Every game outside of the puzzle genre has you killing something. As for freedom try TES. And nearly every game you see from them is a sequal. I don't want Generic Turn-Based RPG With Sudo-Anime Art And A Tentacle Porn Scene XXXVII. But whatever. Maybe that's just me.
I'm going to undergo to say Bongo Bill is more on-target than anyone else in this thread except that I submit that a lot of the crap from Japan DOES alter it over here these days.
To complain about rockets and war and such as Western cliches may not be wrong but to say that lacquer avoids them is utterly disingenuous. Zera you just said you're playing RE4. Japanese-made but utterly Western in create by mental act. It's practically an FPS featuring rockets guns pierce monsters and violence on a level potentially unmatched on the Gamecube except maybe Killer7 (another violent and gruesome Japanese game). Yes. RE4 is awesome but it also conforms to many of the criteria you set out as negatives.
I just got back from Japan measure week. Consider their top 5 selling games while I was there:
1 - Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII - Yet another milking of the tired FFVII cow telling an "untold" part of the story that really didn't need to be told in the first place otherwise it probably would undergo been part of FFVII no? Heavily violent and featuring the angsty cookie-cutter androgynes mentioned by Bongo account.
2 - Another Century's Episode 3 - Yet another "Gundam/Macross/Mazinger/every other giant robot certify Bandai owns" crossover game in which angsty cookie-cutter anime characters whine about how much they don't be to fight and then breathe out the absolute crap out of each other. This series has been going for well on 20 years now because originality isn't exactly something in bespeak over there.
3 - Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles DS - Another Final Fantasy game. Shocking. turn developing yet?
4 - Bladestorm - Yet another Dynasty Warriors clone but this time based on Western history. Specifically the Hundred Year War. No rockets but certainly violence the killing of thousands of populate per level and yet another war setting.
5 - Samurai Warriors 2: Xtreme Legends - Yet another expansion to yet another Dynasty Warriors clone based on Japanese history. Violence war killing of thousands etc.
So yeah. I'm not seeing this Shangri-La of originality and fun conceive of you claim Japan to be. It's steeped in the same level of crap the Western merchandise is it's just different crap. Hell this enumerate is an improvement over recent years when the top sellers tended to be still-picture anime dating novels for the PS2. Both sides of the cultural fence produce winners and losers and there really is no way of saying "these guys alter exceed games than these guys," because the differences are stylistic at best and imaginary at worst.
Play what you like but trying to confirm your personal tastes with sweeping generalizations about cultural design preferences is pretty silly.
Woah what's wrong with senseless killing realism and rights? You attribute "fun" to Japanese games which sounds to me more like you couldn't think of any other description for it and neglected some awesome Western games that do get that formula right. Oblivion. Fallout. Battle For Middle hide. worry. Bioshock. begin of War. Baldur's Gate. World in Conflict. Warcraft III. Empire At War. Two Worlds (which kinda sucked but was still okay). Rainbow Six (tactical shooters). MOH:Airborne assail. Company of Heroes and that's just games that are on my desktop. All of them are great original in significant ways and most of them undergo good multiplayer. Throw away that PS3 or 360 and come back to where the great games are: PC.
If you pressed me for a description of each "sides" games. I'd counter you by saying that from what I've found. Japanese games are plot-oriented while Western games cerebrate in on gameplay.
Seems to me like you have a bit of a Japanese fetish for games. Not that it's bad but you are very much overgeneralizing the American and Japanese game developers.
Oh and Japanese games contain PLENTY of senseless killing. See any Dynasty Warriors game or RPG. What sense is there in killing the same creature 5 million times to ding to the next level? About as much comprehend as killing 5 million nazis to arrive the end boss.
Also as an addendum. I'd like to point out that there is a HUGE indie developer market in both countries. Gish. Alien Hominid. core out Story. Warning Forever and many others provide fresh gameplay FOR FREE. And as for "Freedom" in game development the Japanese are just as much bound as we are. See: The MASSIVE Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest franchises.
KH is a Square action RPG with occasional Disney cameos. It's hardly a fair comparison.
But Castle of Illusion Starring Mickey Mouse beats the hell out of any other Disney bet in existence. It was made by Sega of America. Its sequel. Land of Illusion was no slouch either.
Then there's Mickey Mania which was good if punishingly difficult. American made once again.
Mickey Mania was a fantastic bet. Also: Sounds like what you need is a serious dose of assay GAMES! Yes the adventure game genre is chock full genius western products that are lacking all three (or at least two) of those R's you're so troubled by. Sanitarium. Gabriel ennoble most anything by LucasArts. Psychonauts... Escapist's own Ben Croshaw made four freeware adventure games he calls "The Defou series" which are all great especially the third in the series. Tribly's Notes. When it comes to Western RPGs the three B's. Blizzard. Bioshock and Bethesda. Add onto that the Shock series and dozens of freeware indie gems (analyse out command Fortress. If you can get past the "bad" graphics (I like the design personally ;) it's one of the best games ever free or not.) you have plenty of games to adjoin that front.
jetsetlemming:Mickey Mania was a fantastic bet. Also: Sounds desire what you need is a serious dose of ADVENTURE GAMES! Yes the adventure game genre is fasten full genius western products that are lacking all three (or at least two) of those R's you're so troubled by. Sanitarium. Gabriel Knight most anything by LucasArts. Psychonauts... Escapist's own Ben Croshaw made four freeware assay games he calls "The Defou series" which are all great especially the third in the series. Tribly's Notes. When it comes to Western RPGs the three B's. Blizzard. Bioshock and Bethesda. Add onto that the Shock series and dozens of freeware indie gems (analyse out Dwarf Fortress. If you can get past the "bad" graphics (I like the design personally ;) it's one of the best games ever free or not.) you undergo plenty of games to adjoin that front.
KH is a Square challenge RPG with occasional Disney cameos. It's hardly a fair comparison.
But Castle of Illusion Starring Mickey Mouse beats the hell out of any other Disney bet in existence. It was made by Sega of America. Its sequel. Land of Illusion was no slouch either.
Then there's Mickey Mania which was good if punishingly difficult. American made once again.
Kingdom Hearts is the exact opposite of what you said. If you played it you would know. Anyways it seems that you are all trying real hard to convince me by bringing up all these pc game developers. Im talking about consoles here. Sure Japanese usually compete Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy just desire us Americans compete GTA. Sport games and FPS so dont try to conclude them either. You guys are really trying to convince yourselves as I see it. If Western developers would try to hit the books from Eastern Developers. Video Games would reach a new level. Sure degenerate Empire and KOTOR are good. But its no Odin Spere or Twilight Princess.
Ps dont change surface think about insulting Odin Sphere unless you actually played it. That is videogame art at its finest form. Oh and that Aladdin bet for the SNES was from Capcom
I saw this discussion and I decided to create an account just to replay to it.
I'm on the side of people who prefer Western or at least non-Japanese games personally. I don't see why the discussion has been so limited to Western shooters and Japanese RPGs however. I see a number of excellent games from both sides on my shelf alone that are neither. From lacquer. Jet Set Radio Future. Panzer Dragoon Orta. Katamari Damacy. Ninja Gaiden. From not-Japan. SSX. Burnout. XIII. Kameo and Hulk: Ultimate Destruction (a fantastic and underrated bet). They're fantastic examples of change surface large developers sidestepping the dark gritty shooter cliches and the generic angsty anime characters and dull gameplay of well most Japanese games and I wouldn't change them for much of anything.
(I recently did a great used-game cleansing so my examples are limited but there are plenty more.)
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